Magna Owners Of Texas

Public Forums => The Garage => Topic started by: bobbalee on November 19, 2019, 10:23:16 PM

Title: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on November 19, 2019, 10:23:16 PM
About a month ago I changed the air filter. I made sure I was low on gas to ease the task.
Since I bought the bike there's been a flat spot at about 1500-2000 rpms. After the filter change I was at a light and when it changed the bike died when I gave it gas. Got it to the side and it seemed to be flooded, but no gas smell. My gas vent isn't impeded and the fuel line is flexible. I thought maybe something got dislodged while handling the tank. So I put some Seafoam in it. Then drove 15 miles home. Put thirty miles on it today. Tank was full, put 3ozs. of seafoam in it. There is a miss that I can't detect all the time, but I think it may be in the right front cylinder from the sound of it.
All pipes will boil water after warming up. I reached 5200 rpms for a few seconds but it runs rough between 1500-3000 rpms. I have ordered a set of plugs.
Wondering what you guys might think of this situation.

 
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: hootmon on November 19, 2019, 11:17:10 PM
Double check the vacuum line on the right side going to the fuel shut off valve..
Maybe you have a leak and it is not fully opening the diaphragm, or the diaphragm might have a pin hole in it..
This is only one possibility, you could bypass the shut off and see if the problem changes...
The flat spot is pretty normal on a stock set up.. Adding a shim to each needle helps...
Does it run better with the choke on?? IF so, you might have gotten some trash in the slow speed jets.. Keep up with the seafoam..
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on November 20, 2019, 08:55:19 AM
 It's warm here so the choke isn't needed, but I'll check that.
It's odd to me but it idles just fine, but gets rough at 1500 rpms. That lasts 'til about 3000 then the problem is overridden by sheer volume. But it just isn't quite right, I can tell by the sound.
Waited for a while and cranked It and it started right up, but there's like a miss that's not consistent, but definitely on the right side.
Thanks for the help.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: Lurkin on November 21, 2019, 12:44:58 PM
I would suspect a clog in one or more of the jets/needles, or a leak in a diaphram.  When mine clogged up one time, I could start it and run at idle, but almost any throttle would kill it.  Keep trying seafoam, but may require a jet cleaning operation. 
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on November 22, 2019, 08:25:42 AM
I've been helping a friend recover from knee replacement , so haven't been home. By fuel shutoff do you mean the petcock?
I'll be back home this afternoon and hope to get to it.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on November 23, 2019, 01:52:29 PM
40 degrees here, started with the choke. Ran fine at first after warmup, but was dying at 2k rpm. After staying with it I got it to run but still not good from 1500 to 3000 rpm.
I'm going to take the tank off and check all hoses and wires.
I haven't started it since Tuesday.
I also learned that knee replacement isn't fun. Seems to be a painful recovery.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: hootmon on November 24, 2019, 08:50:25 PM
I've been helping a friend recover from knee replacement , so haven't been home. By fuel shutoff do you mean the petcock?
I'll be back home this afternoon and hope to get to it.
NO.. If you follow the fuel line from the tank it goes to a disc looking device (Vacuum shut off) on the right side of the bike. That device has a fuel in hose, fuel out hose, and a vacuum line that runs to the front cylinder right by the faux airbox on the right side.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on November 25, 2019, 09:25:27 PM
NO.. If you follow the fuel line from the tank it goes to a disc looking device (Vacuum shut off) on the right side of the bike. That device has a fuel in hose, fuel out hose, and a vacuum line that runs to the front cylinder right by the faux airbox on the right side.
[/quote]

I found it. I ordered a diaphragm repair kit. I have a Honda Service Manual and owners' manual, but they ignore It  for the most part, and call it something else.
The bike starts fine and runs smooth with the choke out, even idles ok once it warms up. Something I've never noticed before is that as it warms up the idle speed picks up until it hits 1000 rpms, which is what always has been the idle speed.

I appreciate You taking time to answer.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: TLRam1 on November 26, 2019, 05:09:47 AM
Other then the vacuum shut-off most everything fuel related is dirty carbs, I haven't read through these post, maybe I should, if this doesn't do  it pull the carbs and clean well including pulling the jets and cleaning them and all the circuits.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on November 26, 2019, 07:36:31 AM
I 'm hoping to avoid the can of carb worms. But if I have to I will. I am not a big fan of wrench turning, but will do it when necessary. Guess I need to buy a carburetor tool anyway. I should have the diaphragm Friday.
Thanks for responding.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: Forrestway on November 26, 2019, 08:45:50 AM
What carburetor tool are you going for, Bobbalee?
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on November 26, 2019, 01:14:36 PM
What carburetor tool are you going for, Bobbalee?
I have seen more than one, but motion pro is the one I may buy.
The tool is a 90 degree small socket wrench. The socket required is a "D" shaped one. If you search Amazon you should find them.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on November 26, 2019, 08:44:24 PM
https://www.motionpro.com/product/08-0229
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: Lurkin on December 02, 2019, 10:40:06 AM
40 degrees here, started with the choke. Ran fine at first after warmup, but was dying at 2k rpm. After staying with it I got it to run but still not good from 1500 to 3000 rpm.
I'm going to take the tank off and check all hoses and wires.
I haven't started it since Tuesday.
I also learned that knee replacement isn't fun. Seems to be a painful recovery.
So, is it running fine over 3k rpm's?  If so, it's not the shutoff diaphragm, as that would affect high rpms even worse.  If it is running ok at +3k, then it really sounds like the needles or needle jets as the CV carbs fuel flow goes from pilot, to mid to main circuits.  Sounds like your mids are gunked.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on December 05, 2019, 11:07:16 AM
Before I jump into the carburetor cleaning, do you think I should have a carburetor rebuild kit on hand? The one I mean is the one with gaskets and o rings.
The bike has 43,374 miles on it.
I have a sonic cleaning tank and tiny brushes, along with carb cleaning spray.
Thanks to Greg for the tips he published here, that's helpful to someone who has never pulled Magna carbs.
Rejetted my Suzuki so not a complete stranger.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: TLRam1 on December 05, 2019, 11:54:59 PM
Yes I would replace gaskets and O-Rings when the carbs are apart. When you go in, make sure and clean them right the first time, don't want to do this twice.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on December 06, 2019, 08:39:31 PM
Got parts ordered and they shipped today.
The stock horn sounds a little wimpy so ordered a louder one to boot.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: TLRam1 on December 12, 2019, 08:58:39 PM
Did you get your parts in yet?
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on December 16, 2019, 05:34:08 PM
Some parts made it, but some are coming on a slow boat from Japan.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on December 17, 2019, 08:30:22 AM
Got an email that my order has shipped.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on December 18, 2019, 10:33:01 PM
When I changed the air filter I noticed a little box on the side. I looked at it and I think put my finger in it. Later looked it up and it's a sub air filter.. There was no element in it so I ordered one. Today I  decided to put the element in. There was a gooey substance in there that I  think may be the source of my problem. Used carb cleaner and brake cleaner with an old toothbrush to clean up the sub air filter box. Now at least I have a sub air filter.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: TLRam1 on December 18, 2019, 11:01:25 PM
If it is what I think those filters always deteriorate, we cut new filters out of filter material to put back in, that will not be your issue.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on December 20, 2019, 08:20:45 AM
I was thinking that I may have dislodged a piece of that goo since changing the air filter preceded the problem.

That sub-air filter element is so dense I don't see how any air gets though it. I think some engineer laughed when that design was accepted.
Parts should be here today, so I can get to it this weekend.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: TLRam1 on December 20, 2019, 03:10:49 PM
Many times you will find pieces of the air filter in the carbs inside the slider IIRC.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on December 24, 2019, 09:02:26 PM
Got the carb assembly loose, after much care and patience. I will definitely seal the air filter box on reassembly. Sprayed the assembly with carb cleaner. Will get to the disassembly next. But it is Christmas eve. Merry Christmas everybody.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: TLRam1 on December 25, 2019, 02:36:10 AM
Merry Christmas to you also.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on December 26, 2019, 09:06:54 PM
Clogged low range jets and one clogged main jet.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: TLRam1 on December 27, 2019, 03:46:51 AM
Great to find the problem!

Just make sure all passages and even the jets that do not looked clogged, clean them, run something through there to get any film off the walls.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on December 27, 2019, 04:27:01 PM
Yep, definitely used my carb brushes, cuz I paid five bucks for 'em. But they were worth it.  :)
Saw that filter residue in the sliders.
Am now in the reassembly process. Taking my time to get it right.

I had thought ethanol put an end to clogged jets. The bowls and everything were clean, well compared to the gum and varnish of the sixties and seventies.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: TLRam1 on December 29, 2019, 01:03:09 AM
Waiting to hear how it runs after this.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: hootmon on December 31, 2019, 10:41:40 AM
sorry I have been away from the thread for a while..
Great that you are dealing with this...
My problem is one step deeper and that is the seals on the fuel cross over tubes..
I have my carbs out and have taken it to my local mechanic (I included parts with the carbs).
I'm sure I could take them apart, not quite as sure about getting them back together!! LOL..
I frequently run a little SeaFoam thru my tank.. The bike does occasionally sit, and it takes no time to clog up those little idle jets... The SeaFoam stabilizes the fuel and helps keep the jets cleaned out..
Keep us updated on your progress...
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on January 03, 2020, 08:58:28 AM
Got the reassembly done. Battery is a little weak,so turning it over requires a break for charging.1.5 amp chargers aren't fast. It dawned on me that it may take a while to prime four carbs when the fuel only flows while the motor is turning over. Got a little bit of a start but the battery needs another charge.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on January 03, 2020, 08:11:37 PM
Got it started. I replaced the vacuum line from the fuel cut off to the engine about a week ago because the end at the engine felt hard from the heat. I put the old one back on and It started. The new one was thicker than the old one, but maybe a little smaller opening. I also put new band type clamps in place of the wire type that were on it. Put the old ones back.
It's back to running like before with the flat spot at about 1800 rpms.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on January 06, 2020, 09:21:16 PM
Went to town today, and It runs better than before. But I was wishing that I had done the Dodge shims while I was at it.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: TLRam1 on January 07, 2020, 03:26:47 AM
Should be running a whole lot better. Now that you have done it once, much easier the next time to add the shims.

Do you have a stock air filter and stock pipes?
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on January 07, 2020, 05:11:44 AM
Yes, stock filter and pipes.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: hootmon on January 07, 2020, 07:50:47 AM
yes the 2nd shim helps with that lull between 3-4K RPM.. I believe you can remove the diaphragm lids without pulling the carbs..
Here is a helpful hint.. Once you have removed the lid, take one of the lid screws and thread it into the middle of the Diaphragm, then use the screw to pull the diaphragm out.. A firm tug will do it..
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on January 07, 2020, 10:03:47 PM
Thanks for the tip, I didn't think of that when I had it apart. Once I found the clogged jets I wanted to get back on the road.
Today I fixed my turn signals. Good video on u tube helped me. Motorcycle medic I think. Anyway my sporadic to nonexistent turn signals are fixed.
During my wait for parts my research led me to a reason for overheating, which is too lean carbs. My temperature light would come on after riding on hot(90-95 degrees) days while sitting at a traffic light. Not sure I am ready to try synchronizing yet, but changing the mixture may help.

I appreciate all of the responses from everyone.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: hootmon on January 08, 2020, 06:09:50 PM

During my wait for parts my research led me to a reason for overheating, which is too lean carbs. My temperature light would come on after riding on hot(90-95 degrees) days while sitting at a traffic light. Not sure I am ready to try synchronizing yet, but changing the mixture may help.

I appreciate all of the responses from everyone.
I 95% guarantee that this is the Radiator Thermister..
If you are sitting on the bike, look on the left side of the radiator. There is a round sensor screwed into the radiator.. THIS is your overheat problem.
Buy a new one and replace it.. I've had to replace 2 of those out of 3 gen 3's I've had.. 
It controls when the fan comes on.
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: TLRam1 on January 09, 2020, 05:17:12 AM
Assuming you have checked the radiator and it is full along with the reserve tank to the "full line".

My temp light flickered the other day also while sitting, this was unusual, it was dark and could not tell if the fan came on or not. 
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on January 09, 2020, 07:59:29 AM
I had to remove the lines on the water pump to access the clamp on the right rear carb, so lost about a cup of coolant which I replaced. I checked the coolant when I first experienced that annoying red light. When it happens while I'm parking somewhere I use the kill switch and let the fan run, never takes more than a minute to shut off.
 Just a heads up, I got my hydraulic lift from www.discountramps.com. It was the best deal I found a few years ago. They have a lot of things a man can use.
Radiator thermister isn't showing up on any exploded diagrams I've seen, but there is a forty to sixty dollar switch that looks like it will be it.
 
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: hootmon on January 10, 2020, 07:01:51 PM
I had to remove the lines on the water pump to access the clamp on the right rear carb, so lost about a cup of coolant which I replaced. I checked the coolant when I first experienced that annoying red light. When it happens while I'm parking somewhere I use the kill switch and let the fan run, never takes more than a minute to shut off.
 Just a heads up, I got my hydraulic lift from www.discountramps.com. It was the best deal I found a few years ago. They have a lot of things a man can use.
Radiator thermister isn't showing up on any exploded diagrams I've seen, but there is a forty to sixty dollar switch that looks like it will be it.
The Thermister issue isn't that it doesn't turn the fan on, it's that it turns it on too late and shuts off too early..
If you want to see if it's the Thermister..
Just start the bike before a ride.. Unplug the wire from the thermister.. Run a wire from the wire you just disconnected to ground.. The fan will come on, no go for a ride under the conditions when the light would normally come on...
If the light still comes on, you have another issue.. If the light never comes on, it's most likely the Thermister..
Title: Re: 2002 magna
Post by: bobbalee on March 05, 2020, 02:12:08 PM
Now that I've run a couple of tanks of gas through it my bike is doing much better.
This weather is keeping me from riding much. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and expertise.
The next thing is a front tire. I know a guy with a manual tire machine, may see about using it to save a few bucks. I'm not sure but the nearest place to have a tire changed is Canton I believe.