Magna Dark Side

[Len Averyt]

How are things going with the tire... Give us some more details..
What would you do different?? Uni-directional tire as suggested?
Does the size you install seem to be the right choice?
etc..

So far i have put over 200 miles on the tire and this is what i have noticed.
I have noticed a 500 rpm drop at 70mph (4500rpm+/-) use to be closer to 5K
Much smother ride over rough blacktop.
haven't noticed any gain or loss in maneuvering at speed.
Bike seams to roll easier when pushing back out of my driveway / garage. (Could just be a mental thing )
As for the size, i like it. it gives it a neat look.
however the taller size does change the front to rear height. I have my springs at full height to compensate for my...Well...um.. heavy arse.

[hootmon]

Len;
  If you are happy with your experience you may want to update the below website...

I'm guessing this is where the Subject Referrence came from .. But here it is for everyone else..
http://darkside.nwff.info/

BTW - On the safety link -
Kumho 195/65/R15 89H At 110 psi IT BLEW UP!
You may want to read - "A word about SAFETY!!!"

[Curtis_Valk]

Hey Len, you've got some company: http://forums.delphiforums.com/DarkSiding/messages?msg=585.1

Curtis

[Magnum Magna]

Hey Len, you've got some company: http://forums.delphiforums.com/DarkSiding/messages?msg=585.1

Curtis

That person reports

Ordered the BF Goodrich T/A Radial 155/80R-15 today!!!

Evans Tire.... pick up tomorrow!   $85




"Had the BF Goodrich 155/80R-15 T/A Radial installed on the '94 Magna VF750!

Just got back from picking it up..  only rode the 10 miles from the shop to home, but feels like it's gonna be perfect!

Tire seated at 70 psi.   Max pressure is 35... starting out at 32 psi."

[TLRam1]

Hmm, A radial matched with a bias.

[TLRam1]

I might be willing to give one a shot.

I do wonder about cornering, with the edge being boxier I would think it would want to lay over all of a sudden if your not use to it and will it grip well on corners and in wet weather. What's the percentage of rubber on the ground verses the a stock rounded profile? How many miles can you get out of one?

[Curtis_Valk]

Now I can only speak from my Valk experience mind you, but.........

I would think it would want to lay over all of a sudden

Actually the opposite is true, the bike wants to stand up since the contact patch is further off center than it would be with a MC tire.

will it grip well on corners and in wet weather.

Very well.  The car tire has increased my confidence in wet weather.  I no longer have to be so gentle with the throttle while leaned.  And I'm talking about the slimey, oily city streets at intersections.

What's the percentage of rubber on the ground verses the a stock rounded profile?

In every example that I have seen, the contact patch when leaned over for the CT is still larger than the MC tire at any attitude.

Hope this helps,
Curtis

[TLRam1]

Curtis, Do you think the auto rubber is as sticky as MC rubber? How many miles on a tire?


Curtis and Dave, this is what you need to mount on your tourpak. I'll lead,  .

[lragan]

So, are the folks who design and market MC tires misinformed, or are they playing to our collective ignorance?

[Len Averyt]

Hey Len, you've got some company: http://forums.delphiforums.com/DarkSiding/messages?msg=585.1

Well theres plenty of room.

[Curtis_Valk]

Curtis, Do you think the auto rubber is as sticky as MC rubber? How many miles on a tire?

It seems stickier to me, but it may just be the increased contact patch.  On dry pavement and turning right off of a side street into traffic for instance, I don't have to wait until the bike is straight before cranking the throttle hard.  Considering the torque of the Valk in first gear, that's saying a lot.  On hard level launches I can still spin the tire, but it's still trying to claw its way forward.  In fact on the "big" Valk it's trying to spin the rear tire and lift the front one at the same time.

I cannot report personally on mileage.  Others are reporting 20k miles at the very least from their car tire and some over 30k.  That's one thing I find amusing about some of the arguments/discussions between proponents and nay-sayers.  Many on both sides think it is purely about saving money.  For me personally, I went Dark side only out of curiosity and then stayed dark side because of the increased performance (especially on city streets with quick turns, lane changes and frequently wet, oily pavment).  Ironically I was reluctant to go Darkside on my full touring Valk even though it gets the most highway miles.  The car tire works you a bit harder as far as input into the handlebars goes.  The Valk takes a firm hand anyway and I wanted to keep the neutral feel for more relaxed touring.  Bottom line is that I find the car tire will do anything the MC tire will do, it just takes a bit more rider input.

Curtis

[Curtis_Valk]

So, are the folks who design and market MC tires misinformed, or are they playing to our collective ignorance?

A very valid question.  I don't know where this will eventually go (market-wise) but right now I think it is still under the radar.  I wouldn't be surprised if liability concerns alone keep any innovation of this type squelched.

Could they make a better MC tire?  I'm convinced they could and can, but have no reason to.  We are a captive market.  The only innovation has been in rubber compounds and tire construction in the racing market.  How much of that innovation has made it to the street, except in the form of sport bike tires?  Here is a quote from Daniel Meyer who sums it up pretty well:

25 years ago, a tire for my car cost $35 and lasted about 30,000 miles. Occasional failures of tread or bead/such were expected, but not frequent.

Today, a tire for my car costs $90 and lasts 70,000 miles. Failures are unacceptable and very unusual and are covered by extensive warranties. We've tripled the price and more than doubled the miles. In addition the technologies have made them handle better in cornering, wet-traction, braking, and heat-shed than ever before.

By contrast, 25 years ago, a tire for my motorcycle cost about $20 and I could expect it to last 8000-10,000 miles. Failures were common and there was no warranty coverage beyond the first install. The tire maker would provide instructions and materials on the safest and permanent way to repair a simple puncture.

Today, a tire for my motorcycle costs just over $200 and I can only expect it to last 8000-10,000 miles. The price is 10 times higher and I can expect no additional miles. Failures are frequent and there is no warranty coverage beyond that it will hold air when you first install it. The manufacturers will look you in the eye and inform you that there is no-way, no-how that a single puncture can be repaired-throw the tire away. Although there have been technology improvements in the super-gummy race-bike tires, the cruiser tires perform about the same as they did when I started riding.

My point here is that motorcycle tires for my street bike are 25-year old technology, at prices we should not see for another 50 years when compared to car tires. They've got us, and they know it. Why develop new or keep prices competitive, when folks will (must) by the crap you were putting on the street 25 years ago? Simply, we are a niche market. A manafacturer will sell more car tires in a day, than motorcycle tires in a lifetime. Their R&D money goes to the car tire market. The meager development done in the motorcycle world is concentrated on the race circuit, where the publicity really is. Those tires are doing truely amazing things, but are not suitable for the street.

He has some excellent thoughts on many aspects of the Darkside.  You can read more here: http://lifeisaroad.com/stories/2004/10/27/theDarkSide.html

Curtis

[TLRam1]

I will probably give one a shot also.

I rode a VRod and had to fight the bike to lay over in the corner, didn't care for that aspect, once you get use to it,  it' probably okay. I keep reading about wide tires on bikes and lack of ease to corner than when it does you get the feeling of falling into the corner.

I'll try it than I'll know if it's for me.

[TLRam1]

Curtis and Len,

What are the issues with putting a radial and bias type tire together? In this setup is radial recommended, do you know why, or is there no bias type tires available?

Len, what other tires are there that you ran across which would fit?

Due to the size of the tire, weight or rolling resistance, does this affect gas mileage or top end speed?

I looked up Toyo and didn't see a size Len used, do you have others for me to look at Curtis?

 

[hootmon]

The tire used by others and recommended is a 155 BF Goodrich Radial T/A