Does anyone make pipes for the 3rd gen magnas that are longer than the stock? like the ones that extend as far as the end of the fender? Seems like all the after market pipes sound different but non of them look different besides being thinner the whole way instead of getting fat toward the ends
I've never seen pipes as you describe for a Magna. Grab a welder...... :lol:
And find a good chrome shop!
So with someone that has welding skills which i have a friend that does welding and powder coating and such for a living, would it be possible to fabricate straight pipes to get rid of the upward slope to give it that sleek look and more clearence for bags?
Back in the day, I was involved in tuning exhausts for racing. Drastically over-simplified, long pipes like you describe are generally not advised for high-rpm engines. The pulses travel down the pipe to the end as positive pressure waves (with negative pressure areas between), and then reflect back up toward the exhaust valve as negative pressure waves (with positive pressure areas between). Ideally, the negative wave should reach the valve just before it closes, helping to scavenge the combustion chamber, allowing a full intake charge to enter. If the positive pressure area arrives at the valve at this time instead, it can cause the combustion chamber to partially refill itself with exhaust gas, preventing a full charge of intake, at a cost of power output. Knowing that these waves travel at ~ the speed of sound, it is possible to tune the pipe length to use the waves beneficially. In general, the higher the rpm, the shorter the pipe needs to be.
Disclaimer: This is not intended as a 100% accurate representation, but rather a generalized sketch of the theory.
Very well explained. I think I understand this. Similar to radio transmission lines in concept.
One of the benefits of the slash cut is that it softens the reflection a bit by spreading it over a longer distance.
In theory, one can tune the exhaust correctly at only one rpm setting, given a perfect pipe, etc.
I would have to go through the math, but it doesn't seem to me that a few inches onto the several feet that already exist on my header/exhaust combo would change the resonance all that much...
that would explain the short pipes on the magna chopper mod i posted in another thread.
Yes, the slash cut helps a little, reverse-cone megaphones even more, and it's amazing just how much difference a few inches can make. (Ask your gf, lol.) And it's true that power output is optimized at one specific rpm, but done properly, it can be spread so as to be beneficial over as much as 20 to 25% of the rpm range of an engine with a 5,000-6,000 rpm redline. In the case of a 10,000 rpm engine such as the Magna, however, it would take considerable massaging to gain over a range of more than 10-15% (at the expense of losses everywhere else). Bottom line: if it were mine, I'd leave it alone. YMMV ;)
So... Does this mean that the factory exhaust has been tuned to give the maximum horsepower, torque, etc..? If this is the case, taking out baffles, cutting exhaust, could be bad..Correct?? I am also amazed that companies like vance and hines, jardine, cobra etc... can build a better exhaust than the factory.. Is this the case?? I read on this site somewhere were someone had mentioned that honda pretty much is squeezing the most out the magna engine with the stock exhaust.. I understand that aftermarket exhaust means better flow, more horsepower, sound better, etc. etc. But, how much more.. If we talking about 10-15 horsepower differences I could understand paying $300-600 for exhaust, but to gain 5 horsepower?? Hmm... Lance
A gain of 5 hp in an engine making under 100 hp is actually a decent gain and will be felt by "seat of the pants" testing. It all goes to percentages. While 5 hp is nothing in a 350 hp engine, you will smile when gaining it on a 100 hp engine.
Aftermarket exhaust makers ADVERTISE better flow, more power, etc., but in actuality, it's all about the sound. Most times they can cost you power, unless you make other mods at the same time, regarding air-fuel ratio, cam profile or timing, or a myriad of other things.
The factory exhaust is not optimum for any specific rpm, but has been tuned to give the best compromise over the broadest rpm range. If you want to change the sound, by all means you can modify or replace the stock setup, just don't expect any huge gains. Do a dragstrip run with stock exhaust, then do the same run under the same conditions on the same bike with a modified or aftermarket exhaust, and no other changes. You'll be surprised.
That being said, I have drilled end plates on my stock exhaust, but it wasn't for performance. I just wanted to be able to hear the exhaust over the wind noise at road speeds, to assure myself that the name on the side of the tank isn't "Singer". lol
I once owned a 96 chevrolet pickup with factory exhaust. After I went to the exhaust shop I choose to put a flowmaster exhaust on and cut off the exhaust after the new muffler. When i left the muffler shop, it sounded awesome.. however, I could tell immediately that i had lost some bottom end torque... But it sounded good... :grin: Lance
I have drilled end plates on my stock exhaust Hey magniac... Could you explain this procedure a little more.. Did you like the sound after you did this mod?? Did you just drill the rivets out or did you drill extra holes?? Thanks Lance
I drilled 6 extra holes, evenly spaced between the rivets. Drilled 'em right on the bike. I suggest if you do this, start with smaller holes, maybe 5/16", then you can enlarge them if you want more sound. Mine are 1/4".
Quote from: L J BAD MAG on July 17, 2008, 11:43:35 AM
I once owned a 96 chevrolet pickup with factory exhaust. After I went to the exhaust shop I choose to put a flowmaster exhaust on and cut off the exhaust after the new muffler. When i left the muffler shop, it sounded awesome.. however, I could tell immediately that i had lost some bottom end torque... But it sounded good... :grin: Lance
Back pressure is the name of the game, included in this is the pressure pulse's as mentioned. Basically we have to setup for how we plan to use the bike and tweak the setup/adjustments to fit that scenario. If ya want more sound then get the sound you want and then chase the carb settings to work with that flow/pressure. ETC.
My end plates are removed, i do notice now that when i open the throttle she doesnt pull as violently as she used to. What needs to be done to the carbs to get it running more as if they werent removed. Do i need to upgrade my air intake, rejet, and re tyme the carbs? If so i have no idea how to do the carb work nor have the propper tools for tyming and whatnot. What would a dealer charge for that type of work to be done.
A Honda dealer probably won't even want to do that kind of work. They will likely tell you to return the exhaust to stock. You'll probably have to find an independent shop.
Hey magniac... Are you pleased with your result after you drilled holes in the end plates?? Debating on doing this mod.. wondering if you wished you had done the full mod (cut off baffle etc. etc) How much louder is it?? Thanks Lance
I on my first 96 had originally drilled holes as Magniac described, it will increase the sound, but for me it was not a sound I preferred. The muffler mod worked best for me for the cost.
I prefer the SuperTrapps and V&H, but they cost just a bit more than the muffler mod :lol:
Thanks greg... maybe i am just being lazy... :lol: It just seems alot easier.. everytime i look at my stock exhaust and think about getting out the drill, I always change my mind.. It just looks good... Lance
If my bike had not come with Cobra pipes in place, I would not have modified it from stock. I don't dislike the sound, but my family and neighbors do.
The bike performs well as it came. Of course, now that I have made the carb mods, installed a K&N, synched the carbs (one of them was off about twice the specified difference), etc., it performs better, and I am not going back. :-D :cool:
I first drilled 3/16" holes. It was a bit louder, but the sound was a little "tinny" if that's the proper word. I then opened the holes up to 1/4" and the sound got a deeper tone without being too much louder. I like it well enough that I plan to leave it this way. It didn't require any jetting, but I did open the screws on the bottom of the carbs to 2 3/4 turns, which helped eliminate the decel popping which resulted from the drilling.
I don't like really loud pipes, just wanted to be able to hear them above wind noise at highway speeds.
BTW, I noticed in my earlier post, I made a typo error, when I said to start with 5/16" and then go to 1/4" if you want more sound. It would be pretty hard to make a 1/4" hole out of a 5/16" one. LMAO Start with 3/16".
Well i broke down and did the muffler mod last night. Cut off the resonators and riveted the end plates back on.. Instead of painting the new rivets, i decided to leave them alone. I thought the metal rivets kind of offset the contrast to the chrome exhaust.( or lazy :lol:). When i got done and started it up at first i wasnt impressed to be honest. So me and my son stood there and listened for a minute or two, and he said, well dad, take it for a ride. (Twist my arm). Took off down the street and that is were it started growing on me.. It wasnt too loud and I could actually hear it for a change... :-D Coming off the throttle at around 7000 rpm is sweet!!!. Thanks guys for all info, was pretty easy... This mod will work great until i can break down for some aftermarket exhaust.. Thanks Lance
Very good. I like the sound also at low RPM is a nice little rumble then after 3000 or so it starts mellowing out.
Which after market pipes give the most growl and rumble. I want the most sound i can get, i like my stocks with end plates removed but stil not loud enough for my young ears haha
At mootmag 6 , Allen Rugg had jardine drag pipes on his magna.. WOW!! They were loud!!! Lance
Actually I have the jardine Megaphones which I think are just as loud IMHO!!!
Sorry Allen.. I just remember them being jardines... I didnt know they made more than 1 set.. :) They sounded real good though.. Lance