I made my third and, for now, final attempt at installing the centerstand this afternoon. I would have to rank it as the most frustrating 2 hours I have spent on anything in recent memory, and now I think I understand why: the holes in the angle brackets don't align properly with the mounting holes on the frame tubes. To compound the problem, even without the centerstand in play, the supplied 13mm bolts did not want to start in the tube. The original bolts, by the way, have 12mm heads. Anybody else find this thing to be a PITA to install? As it is, all I have to show for my efforts is a readjusted rear brake and buggered up threads on the right rear mounting hole on the frame for the footpeg. :x
I'd suggest giving Dobie (cycleistic) a call, I'm sure he'd be happy to help you. I've only heard good things about the centerstand. I've been itching to get one myself one of these days. Good luck with it.
I had no problems installing mine. It took about 15 minutes. It helps to have another person so you can have someone holding it up on each side.
Mine went on no problem. As recommended, call Dobie; you may have a slightly mis-aligned stand. I'm sure he would send you another one. Once on, you'll be very happy with it.
My wife was doing her best to hold up the stand on one side while I tried to get it started from the other. We swapped sides when it became obvious that things weren't working out as planned. That was how I was finally able to prove to myself that the hole are misaligned (vertically, not horizontally). I don't know which is out of spec, but I know which one is easier to fix, if I can find my round files that is. I'll try to give Dobie a call tomorrow to see if he has any other :idea: s that don't include my having to bundle the stand up and ship it back to CA.
It was a real pain installing. My wife was in the house if I needed her but I was able to do it by myself in about an hour or two. I don't remember any technique other then starting on one side, could not get the other side on so took the first side off then started fresh with the other side. I was finely able to get it on.
I also had some problem installing the stand by myself. It appeared the holes in the stand were to low on the angle and once one side was installed you couldn't rotate the stand to the point where the holes lined up on the other side. I very loosely installed one side, then inserted a screwdriver through one of the holes in the stand and frame to leverage it up and was able to start the bolt in the other hole. Then I used my lift to apply additional vertical force to the bottom of the stand to get the other bolt started. Took me a couple hours to work this out if I remember correctly.
I had this issue and left the stand off. I had a pretty good dent in the down tube which could have caused my problem. So I can't attribute it to the stand, yet. When I try to install on the 01 Magna I will know more.
is it worth it?
Thanks to those of you who have replied about finding the installation of the centerstand was difficult. I guess I didn't get a particularly "sloppy" one. It's probably difficult to know how much tolerance to put on the hole diameters and spacing without having Honda's drawings to work from. The fit on mine is like BA's, except getting the bolts in is not an option at present. My round files are a bit too small to do the job with creating a notchy surface, so I think I'll take it in to work and ask the mechanical engineer in my group if I can drop by his shop with it to clean up the holes.
Having said all that, I am actually glad I took the original bolts off. A couple of them are quite rusty on the threads. It's always struck me as being a little odd that Honda had matching bosses on the opposing sides of the frame tubes but didn't provide bolts long enough to engage or even plastic caps to prevent water entry. (http://lh4.ggpht.com/mike.the.sane/SPGst7WjCPI/AAAAAAAAADs/IwI4WuMJbMk/s128/bluduh.gif)
Quote from: Jester on October 14, 2008, 10:52:28 PM
is it worth it?
If I ever get the damn thing on, I'll let you know.
I've been lurking this thread, and double-checked all measurements on bolt holes. I found out that the front holes are indeed too low. All units in stock will be modified before shipping, and anyone who has received a stand that has the problem can alleviate it by using a 5/16" diameter round file and slotting the forward hole upward about 1/32" to 1/16". After making the modification, you should paint the bare metal with a shot of Rustoleum paint. I apologize for the trouble, and I promise all future units will have proper hole alignment. The fixture had indeed gotten somehow misaligned, and the holes were drilled too low.
Thanks for the follow-up, Dobie. You've anticipated what I was wondering, which was how much to remove. Too little is obvious, but too much and it will work up and down on the bolts. I am going to try to modify mine this weekend after a trip to Sears for the right size file.
Quote from: Magnum Magna on October 14, 2008, 11:17:02 PM
Quote from: Jester on October 14, 2008, 10:52:28 PM
is it worth it?
I second that.
I was reading to fast.
I thought it said it is worth it but it said is it worth it.
Yes it is worth it.
Yep, it was the front holes that were my issue.
Dobie,
Look at these photos. I don't know if something is amiss here but on the front I will have to grind a good bit off and will be close to the edge of the metal. I grinded off a bit so far and thought I better ask before I continue. I bought this, tried to install on my 94, wouldn't go so now I am trying on the 01.
THe first 2 are the front and the last the rear.
(http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa214/TLRam1/DSCN8031.jpg)
(http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa214/TLRam1/DSCN8032.jpg)
(http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa214/TLRam1/DSCN8033.jpg)
I bought this center stand a couple of years back. Had to install it by myself, and take it off every fall when I garage the bike for winter clean up and modifications. It has to come off if the lift will fit.
The spring could be a bit stronger, and the tolerances for the axle are a bit loose (wobbly), but other than that, it works fine. I have the BIG Metz out back. I had to put a piece of clear tubing on the "pull down" leg to prevent it from hitting the exhausts - is this supposed to happen?
Quote from: TLRam1 on October 24, 2008, 06:10:05 PM
Dobie,
Look at these photos. I don't know if something is amiss here but on the front I will have to grind a good bit off and will be close to the edge of the metal. I grinded off a bit so far and thought I better ask before I continue. I bought this, tried to install on my 94, wouldn't go so now I am trying on the 01.
THe first 2 are the front and the last the rear.
(http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa214/TLRam1/DSCN8031.jpg)
(http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa214/TLRam1/DSCN8032.jpg)
(http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa214/TLRam1/DSCN8033.jpg)
I finally got the centerstand installed today after failing twice earlier this month. It still took over four hours of painstakingly cleaning all the grit off of it and the frame tubes. lashing it up against the bike with cable ties, checking alignment on the holes, pulling it off, filing the most obviously misaligned hole, and repeating the procedure ad nauseum until I could finally get all four bolts started without having excess play in the holes. I figured out that the front two holes were too low and too far forward and the rear holes were too low and too far to the rear. (http://s5.tinypic.com/kamjon_th.jpg)
I just hope this "labor-saving" device pays for itself with easier general servicing. I will probably be replacing the supplied bolts, which are actually no longer than the stock bolts from Honda, which makes me wonder just how much thread engagement is left. (http://s5.tinypic.com/2it2dtz_th.jpg)
What an infuriating experience. (http://s5.tinypic.com/e8x4d5_th.jpg)
I plan to spend the remainder of my waking hours today self-medicating. (http://s5.tinypic.com/2rokge9_th.jpg)
I am so glad you got it on. I really like having it especially if you take long trips and gone for a week or more.
I used the Red lift to lube the chain and it was a pain to lift the bike.
I never used the 4X4 lift but seen it used at Greg's place and it looks stable but I just never trusted it.
Quote from: Guy Gadois on March 22, 2009, 06:32:14 PM
I will probably be replacing the supplied bolts, which are actually no longer than the stock bolts from Honda, which makes me wonder just how much thread engagement is left.
Mike, you probably know this already, but with healthy threads, virtually all the load is carried in the first few threads. As I recall, the first three account for 90+% of the strength (in tension) of the bolt/nut combination.
Bottom line, if you have like four threads buried, then don't fix stuff that ain't broke.
I use a lift quite often. (I have welded up a balance stand for it.) It is difficult for my tired bones to get up and down a lot whilst working on the bike or anything else. If I am going to do much at all, the work of putting the bike up on a lift pays off in spades.
Thanks to this thread and your post, I am scratching the centerstand off my want list...saving time, money (getting more important every day!) and aggravation (like who needs it?). :?:
Quote from: Guy Gadois on March 22, 2009, 06:32:14 PM
I finally got the centerstand installed today after failing twice earlier this month. It still took over four hours of painstakingly cleaning all the grit off of it and the frame tubes. lashing it up against the bike with cable ties, checking alignment on the holes, pulling it off, filing the most obviously misaligned hole, and repeating the procedure ad nauseum until I could finally get all four bolts started without having excess play in the holes. I figured out that the front two holes were too low and too far forward and the rear holes were too low and too far to the rear. (http://s5.tinypic.com/kamjon_th.jpg)
I just hope this "labor-saving" device pays for itself with easier general servicing. I will probably be replacing the supplied bolts, which are actually no longer than the stock bolts from Honda, which makes me wonder just how much thread engagement is left. (http://s5.tinypic.com/2it2dtz_th.jpg)
What an infuriating experience. (http://s5.tinypic.com/e8x4d5_th.jpg)
I plan to spend the remainder of my waking hours today self-medicating. (http://s5.tinypic.com/2rokge9_th.jpg)
Lucky You, now come do mine since you're experienced! I started and like you it's a pain to jack with so it's still sitting in my garage, about a year and a half. One day I will get back at it.
Quote from: lragan on March 22, 2009, 07:00:52 PMMike, you probably know this already, but with healthy threads, virtually all the load is carried in the first few threads. As I recall, the first three account for 90+% of the strength (in tension) of the bolt/nut combination.
Bottom line, if you have like four threads buried, then don't fix stuff that ain't broke.
In fact, I did not know that, Lawrence. Very good information to have, and thanks for passing it along. :mrgreen:
Quote from: lragan on March 22, 2009, 07:00:52 PMI use a lift quite often. (I have welded up a balance stand for it.) It is difficult for my tired bones to get up and down a lot whilst working on the bike or anything else. If I am going to do much at all, the work of putting the bike up on a lift pays off in spades.
Thanks to this thread and your post, I am scratching the centerstand off my want list...saving time, money (getting more important every day!) and aggravation (like who needs it?). :?:
If you can do everything on the lift you need to do, I don't think a centerstand would buy you much. I rationalized the centerstand on the basis of the what-ifs that can come up on the road and for the need to be able to keep up with chain maintenance on a trip... if I ever take one that would push the lubrication intervals. (I am a long way from challenging most/any of you guys for the title of King of the Road.) Obviously, some people have had examples that were a lot easier to install, but since Robert and Terry -- among others -- also had problems, your mileage may vary.
Anyway, it's on. Now I need to learn how to use it without knocking the bike over. (http://s5.tinypic.com/2wqzsq1_th.jpg)
Further bulletins as events warrant!
Quote from: TLRam1 on March 22, 2009, 11:01:08 PMLucky You, now come do mine since you're experienced! I started and like you it's a pain to jack with so it's still sitting in my garage, about a year and a half. One day I will get back at it.
I have to admit the job got a lot easier once I began using my brain for something other than keeping my ears spaced apart from each other. (http://s5.tinypic.com/2it2dtz_th.jpg)
Since I was working by myself, the biggest frustration was not being able to tell whether I had the holes lined up correctly since I had one hand clamping the stand to the frame and the other trying to keep the footpeg bracket out of the way and couldn't easily adjust the stand fore and aft without its falling away. Then it (finally) dawned on me to get some 14" nylon cable ties from the local home improvement store to use for cinching the stand up against the frame. Once I did that, it was just a matter of making the incremental enlargement to the holes, and I could tell which way and roughly by how much I needed to enlarge each. They are each rather kidney-shaped now. When I was finally able to get all four bolts started, I cut the cable ties, put a good coat of car wax on the frame rails, sprayed some chain wax up and down along the inside length of the angle iron of the centerstand (hoping to avoid having the paint rubbed off the frame and getting rust started) and let it dry until it was tacky, then lashed it back up against the frame with some more cable ties, and was able to manage aligning the right side bracket much more easily without running such a risk of goofing up the threads on the mounting points of the frame.
Next time I'm in Arlington, Terry, I'll send you a PM if I can detach myself from the relatives for a bit, and if you still haven't got the thing on and need a strong back and a weak mind to help out, I'll be happy to lend a knuckle-dragging hand. (http://s5.tinypic.com/2howjf7_th.jpg)
practice with it on a sloped driveway. It is hard to describe but pushing the centerstand around not down works for me.
Terry we can try to install it next Saturday.
Quote from: Guy Gadois on March 23, 2009, 12:05:22 AM
Next time I'm in Arlington, Terry, I'll send you a PM if I can detach myself from the relatives for a bit, and if you still haven't got the thing on and need a strong back and a weak mind to help out, I'll be happy to lend a knuckle-dragging hand. (http://s5.tinypic.com/2howjf7_th.jpg)
When did you say you're coming?? :wink: :P
Quote from: Magnum Magna on March 23, 2009, 12:10:56 AM
Terry we can try to install it next Saturday.
Yes, maybe we can get it done Robert Saturday. It should make it easier for me to move around in my garage for sure.
Quote from: TLRam1 on March 23, 2009, 10:38:54 AM
Quote from: Guy Gadois on March 23, 2009, 12:05:22 AM
Next time I'm in Arlington, Terry, I'll send you a PM if I can detach myself from the relatives for a bit, and if you still haven't got the thing on and need a strong back and a weak mind to help out, I'll be happy to lend a knuckle-dragging hand. (http://s5.tinypic.com/2howjf7_th.jpg)
When did you say you're coming?? :wink: :P
Well, that's just it. I don't know when. When we get out there next, it will probably be for a funeral, and although that may not be too far off in the future, we're hoping the guest of honor can hang on indefinitely.
FWIW guys, I went to the fab/welder and sure enough, found that the jig had somehow got misaligned. We took new measurements and made adjustments, so all units now on hand and future units should be much easier to install. The lifting situation will remain the same, since Honda's sidestand location precludes any mods there. Sorry for the problems you have had with installation, but it should be much easier now.
- Dobie
Success! I finally was able to put the bike on the centerstand today, (http://s5.tinypic.com/289xvv4_th.jpg) and since this thread is worthless without pictures
(http://p1.bikepics.com/pics/2009%5C04%5C11%5Cbikepics-1631056-full.jpg)
I was able to do a little chain cleaning with it on the centerstand and also able to verify that my front brake was releasing properly, since I had had a little concern that the caliper was binding. What was nice was that a 20 lb dumbbell resting on the tail of the seat was enough to bring the front fork off the ground.
Speaking of dumbbells, I dropped my bike for the first time while doing it. (http://s5.tinypic.com/2wqzsq1_th.jpg) Fortunately, I was astride it at the time, so I was able to ease it down onto the engine guard, which suddenly paid for itself several times over. :mrgreen:
IMO, there are only two categories of MC riders -- those who have dropped their bikes, and those who will drop their bikes.
Three cheers for engine guards.
Now if we just had a way to repair the scratched chrome on the outside of the guards... :???:
While generally conceding that all threads need to be left to die a natural death, I thought that given the annoyance I expressed over the difficulty I had in installing the Cycle-istic centerstand that I should bring everything up to date.
The stand has paid itself off handsomely in use. Since installing it, I had to replace the bearings on the rear axle, a job made immeasurably easier by the centerstand, on which the bike has been resting for much of the last month. While I am very much aware of the "poor man's lift" mentioned on the Tip's and Tricks page, the fact is that when the back wheel and the shocks are off, that is the time to check the swingarm bearings for play, something for which the swingarm obviously cannot be used to support the bike. The fact that only about 10-20 lbs of weight is needed on the tail of the bike to bring the front wheel up for work is another point in favor of the Cycle-istic design.
As a coda, I can say that I am now convinced that a centerstand is essential and that from now on, I will not buy a motorcycle for which a centerstand is not available.