Progressive Springs & Front Fork Seals for 3rd Gen

[L J VFR]

Hey, Lance, if I didn't have to pay a power bill for this place, I could afford all sorts of goodies!!

Kidding aside, I hope you get the power back soon.  Did you have a freezer full of food?  Man, what a mess!

It's funny you asked Lawrence, the wife and I had just cleaned the freezer and fridge 2 weekends ago, so we just stuffed everything into ice chests.  4 full ice chest.     Everyone tells me "Go buy a generator" but I am reluctant.  I have a wood stove and I have propane hot water heater.  I just don't see the revelance (sp?) in spending $1000 on something I may not use again.  I have been called tight wad the last few days.  But we are staying warm and we can take hot showers. At night we light candles and visit with eachother.  I have actually got to visit with the wife and kids intead of everybody watching their favorite tv show!

[TLRam1]

Lawrence, no need to scan, I have a question. Wanted to see if you had once to reference. When I have time I will post up my question.

[lragan]

So I went for a short ride today.  Over my favorite twisty (and also quite bumpy) back road.  I really like what the spring change has done for the bike.  Certainly it is no rougher on the straights, over bumps, etc., and may be a bit smoother.  The best indication of this is the view in the mirrors -- which is steady and clear.

The bike is substantially more sensitive to steering input at all but parking lot speeds.  This takes a little mental adjustment on the part of the rider, but once you get onto it, it is really nice!  Lean just a little harder and it turns instantly.  The steering seems more precise because of the quick response to any input from the rider, whether pressure on the handlebars or shifting weight.

The best part happens when you stop.  I can now brake really hard, and stop really quick, without feeling like I am going to flip the bike over the handlebars.  Sweet.

My only regret is that I rode this bike ~10K miles before I made this simple modification.  I highly recommend it to all who ride a 3rd gen.

[L J VFR]

What is the recommendation on changing fork oil. Lawrence did not. Some have.  My bike is a 2001 model.  Is changing the fork oil something that does not have to be done, or just what MOOTsters recommend?

[lragan]

Lance, if you will follow the thread up to Greg's post, he suggested changing to check for worn seals.  Comparing the clarity and color of the oil in my forks (they were pristine -- like it was just poured from a new bottle) to the dark stuff we got out of MagnaDaddy's 1st gen, which was leaking oil, I made the perhaps risky decision to leave it alone.  Quite possibly the evidence that Greg was suggesting is still lying in the bottom of my struts, waiting for some mechanic who knows what he is doing to open the drain bolts and examine what flows out, I don't know.

The other reason to change the oil is to control the damping factor.  Slydnbye in California did not like the 15W oil he put in his and recommended 10W or even 5W.  I ordered 5W.  Then Greg chimed in with a 10W preference, and Terry weighed in with 15W, so I got cold feet and still have my bottle of 5W.

One thing is clear -- if you choose not to change the oil, you will not need to remove the front wheel.  Even if you have too much oil in the struts for the new springs, a baster or other simple little pump can remove enough to get you to the desired level.  Had I not removed the wheel, I could have made the round trip in under an hour with no sweat.  If I did it again, about 30 minutes.

[L J VFR]

Thanks for clarifying this Lawrence.  Looks like I need to go buy some fork oil.   How much oil to buy is still a question.

[lragan]

You are right, I did not answer that question by experiment.  I expect 1 liter is sufficient, given the lower oil level required of the Progressive springs.

Assuming the 521cc listed in the manual is for each tube, it would add to 1042 cc, or a bit over a liter for the stock springs.  However, the inside diameter of the tubes are about 4 cm, and the difference in oil level is 12.2 cm for stock vs. 14.4 for Progressives.  Doing the math, the difference in volume is 2*2*3.14*2.2 =  27.6cc less per side or 55.2 cc total.  Subtracting from the 1042 with stock springs gives a little less than a liter.  So, if you don't spill any, 1 liter should be enough.

I would offer you my 5W, but I really think 10W would be a better compromise, and you can probably buy it locally for less than the shipping.

[L J VFR]

Thanks alot Lawrence. Very helpful info.

[magnagregcan]

I did the springs on my 2000 about 6 years ago. Along with installing a fork brace. The front end is nice and tight: no more squigglies going around bumpy turns at speed (my speed!).
But it seems to me I measured the oil level with the springs in the tubes. I thought some one here said to measure out the oil then add the springs. Would it make that much difference, and would you be more prone to bust your seals out earlier due to overfilling? I don't know; all I know is the bike should of come with this gear already on it. It may have added $50.00 to the price of the bike.

[lragan]

Both the Honda Service Manual for the Magna VF750C/D, and the instructions from Progressive that came with the springs call for measuring the oil with the springs removed.  And, the oil level is actually the amount of air above the oil in the tube.  Thus the stock oil level calls for 122mm, while the Progressive instructions want 140mm, which is less oil.

It would be tedious at best to measure the oil level with the springs in place.  I used a small adjustable square, so I could get the "average" level (since the tubes were on the bike, and not vertical).  I set the stop to the desired level, and lowered the end of the square into the tube, with the square stop being parallel to the triple tree, i.e. pointed directly at the other tube.  This placed the end of the square in the center of the tube.

So tell me about this "fork brace".  Do you have any pictures?

[TLRam1]

Both the Honda Service Manual for the Magna VF750C/D, and the instructions from Progressive that came with the springs call for measuring the oil with the springs removed.  And, the oil level is actually the amount of air above the oil in the tube.  Thus the stock oil level calls for 122mm, while the Progressive instructions want 140mm, which is less oil.

It would be tedious at best to measure the oil level with the springs in place.  I used a small adjustable square, so I could get the "average" level (since the tubes were on the bike, and not vertical).  I set the stop to the desired level, and lowered the end of the square into the tube, with the square stop being parallel to the triple tree, i.e. pointed directly at the other tube.  This placed the end of the square in the center of the tube.

So tell me about this "fork brace".  Do you have any pictures?

Thanks Lawrence, I will add this info to the FAQ section.

[Slydynbye]

Both the Honda Service Manual for the Magna VF750C/D, and the instructions from Progressive that came with the springs call for measuring the oil with the springs removed.  And, the oil level is actually the amount of air above the oil in the tube.  Thus the stock oil level calls for 122mm, while the Progressive instructions want 140mm, which is less oil.

It would be tedious at best to measure the oil level with the springs in place.  I used a small adjustable square, so I could get the "average" level (since the tubes were on the bike, and not vertical).  I set the stop to the desired level, and lowered the end of the square into the tube, with the square stop being parallel to the triple tree, i.e. pointed directly at the other tube.  This placed the end of the square in the center of the tube.

So tell me about this "fork brace".  Do you have any pictures?

You might have highlighted something for me, My info when I did the springs said each shock had a capacity of ~ 16.xx ounces which is a pint plus a skosh more.  So.. I may have too much oil.
I have heard others say just use 1 pint per fork with progressive springs.
That would be too easy.

Sounds like I need I need to have a little wrench session of my own.
Now where did I put my metric mini level 
I was going to just use a coffee stir stick 

[lragan]

OK, Slydnbye, I confess -- I used an English rule.  140mm =5.5 inches, close enough.

[Slydynbye]

OK, Slydnbye, I confess -- I used an English rule.  140mm =5.5 inches, close enough.

Thank goodness
Here I was thinkin "Where is this country headed when a Texan quotes metric measurements."

[L J VFR]

Would it be too simple just to buy 1 liter of fork oil, split in half and dump into each fork?  Then add the progressive springs.  You would be adding 7cc too much oil per fork. Which is what, a drop or two.